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John,<br>
<br>
If you spent more time just *learning* Zope and HTML, etc and less time
rationalizing your lack of progress everyone would be happy.<br>
<br>
David<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
John Poltorak wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid20050621221006.M73@warpix.org" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On Tue, Jun 21, 2005 at 03:15:33PM -0400, Paul Winkler wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On Tue, Jun 21, 2005 at 07:29:20PM +0100, John Poltorak wrote:
re. zopelabs.com:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">It probably is very useful, but I know I'd get hopelessly lost because
there is just so much stuff on it.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">So you prefer to ignore it?
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Just how much time should you spend on something when you are deriving no
benefit just increasing frustration?
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Granted, zopelabs.com has flaws. It's harder to find stuff than it
should be. Nevertheless, browsing that site, along with reading the
Zope book (the old print version), was instrumental in getting me from
knowing nothing, to the point where I became a full-time zope developer.
We didn't even have the great resource of zopewiki.org back then.
Use that too, zopewiki is your friend.
There are tons of good links from <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://zopewiki.org/PageTemplates">http://zopewiki.org/PageTemplates</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Thanks. I'll check that.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">In general, I don't know how you expect to make any progress when your
typical response to the (many) suggestions you receive on this list is
"I can't read that, it's too much work".
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
If I spend a couple of days on something and make no progress, I'd say
it's 'too much work'. Wouldn't you.
I was on a course over the weekend where ordinary people in their 70's
with no technical ability were knocking together websites in just a few
hours with no prior training and no understanding of the
underlying concepts involved. Why should Zope be just as easy?
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Most of the newbie stuff about macros
is probably quite old by now so I doubt whether I'd find it with a
sequential browse through the Cookbook.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">"probably"? "doubt"?
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">It's disappointing to find that the link from Newbies under the ZOPE
section does not function.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">True that. I don't know what happened to zopenewbies.net.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">What I really need is something like a ZPT macro which defines a header
and footer and leaves a slot in the middle for my own content. I don't
expect to be able to write my own macro for quite a while - too many
pitfalls... I'm not even sure is that is how I should be approaching
writing a home page.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">Have you tried the tutorial that comes with Zope?
It includes at least one simple example of macros - see lesson 4.
Not sure how to run the tutorial? The default index_html for a new Zope
server tells you:
"""There is a built-in interactive Zope Tutorial which gets you started
with some simple tasks using the Zope managment interface. To use the
tutorial, go to any Folder and select Zope Tutorial from the add list
and click the Add button. Provide a name for the tutorial and click Add
to begin working with the tutorial.
"""
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
There is a quantum leap between the tutorial and being able to do anything
useful with a website. What the tutorial needs to to handhold you through
putting together something like the homepage of zope.org.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">--
Paul Winkler
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.slinkp.com">http://www.slinkp.com</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
</pre>
</blockquote>
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