I take the point that I approached this issue from the wrong standpoint and apologise for that. This was perhaps born out of a little frustration. I was never rude though. Also I feel that Plone has usabillity which sits above it's prettyness. It is a well designed interface graphically but also has very strong non graphical usability elements.
<br><br><div><span class="gmail_quote">On 2/10/06, <b class="gmail_sendername">Lennart Regebro</b> <<a href="mailto:regebro@gmail.com">regebro@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
On 2/10/06, michael nt milne <<a href="mailto:michael.milne@gmail.com">michael.milne@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>> I've spoken to many people on various lists and can confirm the feeling<br>> about usability on the ZMI etc. You call them 'halfwits'. That puts you on
<br>> rather high ground and this attitude is obviously part of the problem.<br><br>1. By complaining about something that a lot of people do not find any<br>problem with, YOU put yourself on a rather high ground compared to the
<br>people here who both created and use it.<br><br>Suggestion: Don't complain about the software that you want help with,<br>because it makes the people who wrote it pissed off. Quite simple,<br>really.<br><br>2. I have myself held courses in how to use a CMS (EasyPublisher)
<br>where you did most everything through the ZMI for people with bother<br>very little computer experience and a lot, and it was never a big<br>usebility problem. That the ZMI has big useability problems is simply<br>not true. You also claim that there are lot of people complainng that
<br>the ZMI has useability problems. Well, we are on all those<br>mailing-lists, unless you have found some secret mailing lists for<br>people who don't like Zope, so we know that there is in fact NOT a lot<br>of complaints about this.
<br>When you claim that there are loads of people who say so, when there<br>obviously isn't undermines your credbility and inclines people to not<br>take you seriously.<br><br>Suggestion: Don't make up facts and statements that is not true, don't
<br>invent people that doesn't exist. Don't say that X is generally<br>accepted as a fact when it isn't. If you do that, people will call you<br>a liar, and you don't want that.<br><br>(Oh, and if you want an explanation about why a few people don't find
<br>the ZMI useable, it's because it's not "pretty", don't have flash<br>graphics and such. People often confuse "prettyness" with<br>"useability". ZMI is basic and well, ugly. It is however quite
<br>consistent and useable.)<br><br>And the same goes for Zopes access control. It is in no way<br>complicated or hard to understand. By starting early in the discussion<br>with complaining about it, you just make people pissed off and get the
<br>discussion running away in the wrong direction. Don't do that.<br><br>> How come Plone's interface is so useable and a delight to work with? How was<br>> that financed?<br><br>Because it's pretty? :-)<br><br>--
<br>Lennart Regebro, Nuxeo <a href="http://www.nuxeo.com/">http://www.nuxeo.com/</a><br>CPS Content Management <a href="http://www.cps-project.org/">http://www.cps-project.org/</a><br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all">
<br>-- <br>Michael