[ZWeb] NZO Alpha Announcement

Sidnei da Silva sidnei@x3ng.com
Fri, 4 Apr 2003 12:58:23 -0300

On Thu, Mar 27, 2003 at 06:37:09PM -0700, Jeffrey P Shell wrote:
| [quoting PieterB]
| >- Please update the spotlight: 21 august 2001 doesn't look up to date
| I still don't get why this article is the spotlight anyways.  Seeing 
| this makes me thing of dev.nzo.etc.etc. as more mockup than real.


| >- The contact link should link to a form, instead of using a mailto
| >(mailto is bad, unless used for emailadresses). The form should
| >give the user the oppurtinity to post to zope@zope.org for a
| >zope-question, and to zope-web@zope.org for a zope-web question.
| >Clearly state that the message will be sent to an e-maillist which
| >is archived on the web.
| Ooo.  I think this is good.  The current Zope.org feedback page still 
| seems to confuse some users, as is evidenced by the amount of traffic 
| this list sometimes receives that has to do with a particular product 
| or just a general Zope question.  Giving users options as one of the 
| form elements ("Question about Zope?  Problem with this web site?" for 
| example) should cut down on the bad traffic.  I don't know though - 
| messages have to be *clearly* stated, as most people seem to just hit 
| "feedback form" and fill in the elements without looking at surrounding 
| text.  I guess if the message shows up clearly after they submit the 
| form, they'll read it (if it's clear and concise).

I dont think they read anything :P But will work on something like you

| >- You wrote something about linking the mailinglist navigation to
| >lists.zope.org/ mail.zope.org. I think it's bad to have links in
| >the menu directly go to other sites when the user doesn't expect
| >it (with Zope Exits the user expects to leave the zope site).  Why
| >not create a clear, nice looking subpage describing the various
| >Zope mailinglist and how to use them, e.g. warn that zope@zope.org
| >is a high-traffic list, that the lists are archived on the web,
| >etc. That page could have a clear link to lists.zope.org. I think
| >mailman 2.1 new templating system even uses ZPT (not sure), so it's
| >even possible to give the mailman pages a zope.org look and feel
| >(not very high priority, though).
| Another option is to use an extra icon for links that go offsite from 
| large link lists, and those links should always open in a new window.  
| If it's a subpage containing all off-site links, this isn't necessary.

Looks like there is consensus that opening new windows is not
good. Will leave it as-is.

| >What about the wiki's? What's the current state of them? Are you
| >planning to use CMFWiki or Zwiki?
| I would imagine CMFWiki.  I still haven't really heard what the plan is 
| on this - all Wiki's, new and old, valid and obsolete, etc, are moving, 
| or is any attempt being given to clean them up?  If attempt is being 
| given to clean them up, what is that effort and which ones is it 
| touching?  I think the Project Wikis should always stay around and be 
| separate from each other (and I still want to completely redo the 
| fishbowl Proposals part as not-a-wiki).  If any plans are already made 
| about what to do with the devsite stuff, I want to know.

For now, were just converting everything to ZWiki. As Simon pointed
out on Zope3-dev, the whole experience will be improved just by doing
this, because the current wikis on Zope.org lack key features.

| >> - Objects have a 'obsolete' workflow state, that will be used to mark
| >> old content and remove it on the next round of migration.
| >remove it? are zope members given a long period of time to clean
| >up their home dirs? (i don't think a period such as two weeks that
| >is used on plone.org is appropriate for zope.org). Another solution
| >is to make old content hard to find (e.g. moving it to old.zope.org
| >or not searching it by default)
| We have to be careful about 'old.zope.org'.  We don't want to get too 
| dependent on that being around providing obscure functionality.   This 
| happened with the old Collector(s) on 'classic.zope.org'.

No old.zope.org please.

| On top of what Pieter pointed out, I have something else of my own: the 
| ZSP page is in terrible shape on new.zope.org.  I don't know if I've 
| ever seen a version of it that I've liked.  What are the plans for it, 
| and how can I help get it up to something comparable with what exists 
| on Zope.org now - but better (ability to filter/search ZSP's by region, 
| for example)?

I made a first try at it, http://dev.nzo.zope.org/Resource/ZSP

This is a new product called CMFContentList, which makes configurable
listings of objects. Next things I need to add are batching and
searching. Let me know what you think.

| Coming in as anonymous, I got a login error by clicking on "The Zope 
| Book" off of the front page (and in Safari, the login error came across 
| as plain-text HTML instead of rendered).

Ack! Safari seems to not be handling a content type header or something.

| http://dev.nzo.zope.org/Documentation/Books/ZDG/current
| Gave me a TypeError, "sequence index must be integer".  We should 
| decide what to do about "Site Errors".  It's useful to see real errors 
| while the site is in development, but many usability guides say that 
| end users should never see the word "Error".

Dunno what to do about this. I know what caused the error though:
Backtalk has a property named 'header', which by coincidence is the
same name as the macro used to render the template header, so
'here/header/macros/portal_header' gives that funky error. I can fix
that on the migration script. 

Regarding what to do with errors, now that we have Zope2.6, it has the
SiteErrorLog thing, and we could well turn the error page into
something more user-friendly.

| 'new.zope.org' shouldn't show up as a project until its Wiki is up to 
| date.  The first thing the front page of the wiki says is "this is 
| horribly out of date, see this page for more", and the page it points 
| to is a link to a couple of mailing list pages.  That's not inspiring.
| http://dev.nzo.zope.org/news is odd, as there are (No Description) 
| blocks on each item.  I'm guessing this has something to do with the 
| more advanced Dublin Core data of CMF/NZO that doesn't exist in CZO.

Indeed it does. I removed the description now.

| "Community / Report Bugs" points to the ZopeOrg collector (where I 
| probably should be putting all of these items, I guess?), but it should 
| probably point to the main Zope collector, or to the root.  What are 
| the plans to dress up collector.zope.org?

Dunno about collector.zope.org. Its not on scope for this project.

| All Zope Exits links should open in a new window (preferably a window 
| of the same name - <a target="zopeexits" ...>).
| Those are the main things I saw.  There's also a lot of broken or 
| missing content, it seems.  At what point is that stuff expected to be 
| moved over so that it can be really tested, or should we be testing for 
| that now?  Some examples:

Stuff was moved over. The problem is that objects changed meta_type,
and the old listing pages doesnt work anymore. They all need to be
remade, preferably using CMFContentList or ZPT.

| I think what we need, if it isn't asking too much, is a roadmap 
| outlining the next couple steps.  Sorry if this has been posted 
| elsewhere where I haven't seen it. Is there going to be another 
| alpha/milestone before any beta?  What do we want to have done by then?

I think so. Im working on getting CMFLDAP and a LDAP server working
together, and after this we should have alpha2, or beta1 if everything
goes well.

Sidnei da Silva (dreamcatcher) <sidnei@x3ng.com.br>
X3ng Web Technology <http://www.x3ng.com.br>
GNU/Linux user 257852
Debian GNU/Linux 3.0 (Sid) 2.4.18 ppc

All your files have been destroyed (sorry).  Paul.